So far my experience with Nextcloud has been that it is a pain in the arse to install, and once it’s installed is slow as anything. Literally couldn’t run it on my pi 3b, now got it up and running pretty nicely on a NUC but it’s still not great. Have caching set up.
I have the notes app installed on my android phone and I can never used rich text editing because it gives timeout error.
This shouldn’t be this complicated. All I want is to de-Google my documents and notes, and self-host my kanban. I don’t really need the rest though it’s nice to have the options.
Do people use alternatives? Am I doing something completely wrong? I set it up using nginx which I know is not supported, but the alternative using Docker AIO didn’t allow me to use custom port easily.
I seriously suggest you give Nextcloud another go, this time under Docker. Very simple to do.
Save the following in a new folder as docker-compose.yml
version: '3' volumes: db: services: nextcloud-app: image: nextcloud container_name: nextcloud-app restart: always volumes: - ./data:/var/www/html environment: - MYSQL_PASSWORD=changeme - MYSQL_DATABASE=nextcloud - MYSQL_USER=nextcloud - MYSQL_HOST=nextcloud-db ports: - "80:80" links: - nextcloud-db nextcloud-db: image: mariadb container_name: nextcloud-db restart: always command: --transaction-isolation=READ-COMMITTED --binlog-format=ROW volumes: - db:/var/lib/mysql environment: - MYSQL_ROOT_PASSWORD=changeme - MYSQL_PASSWORD=changeme - MYSQL_DATABASE=nextcloud - MYSQL_USER=nextcloudrun this command in the folder -
docker-compose up -dopen http://localhost
Is the mariadb a default part of nextcloud? I’ve seen posts saying to use a separate db so things can be backed up easier, so I was wondering if that’s how you have it set up above.
In this setup the DB is not part of Nextcloud. Both are running in separate services aka containers, which can be administrated independently from each other.
I suspect nextcloud having performance issues with slow Disk IO. With rootless containers I had a much worse performance than rootfull. Also using MySQL Backend instead of SQLite did speedup the performance.
Nevertheless I have the same problems with nextcloud as you stated. Pretty much not as usable as I thought.
It’s on a SATA drive, albeit hard drive not ssd and I’m using mariadb. Everybody seems to suggest I need a beefier server but as a developer myself, the functionality of the software doesn’t seem to warrant anything more powerful.
Software config optimizations help a little bit but my biggest improvement was moving the DB to SSD. Spinning disks are great for capacity but not for DB performance. Random I/O is a big factor for them and those drives drop in performance so fast for that type of I/O due to physically spinning media.
I started out using Owncloud and later switched to Nextcloud once that fork was stable. For all my uses it has always needed beefy hardware to run well but I definitely have way more junk files in synced folders than I should & rarely clean things up.
Try moving the database at least on a SSD, and enable Redis caching.
How much memory? I think nextcloud wants around 8gb to run happily (ymmv). I’ve tried it with smaller sizes and ran into issues.
Yes I have 8gb of ram, but it seems insane that it needs that much considering what it is doing.
I think nextcloud wants around 8gb to run happily (ymmv).
As a developer myself, where did it go wrong?
I’m not sure it’s going “wrong”. It depends on the scenarios it’s designed for. If they intend it to be run on servers (there is no class of raspberry pi that is a server) then you design it to take advantage of those resources.
But it’s designed for selfhosting and consumes all that without doing much.
I didn’t mean to imply it needed server hardware. You can absolutely self-host Nextcloud. But RPIs are the absolutely lowest-end of hardware for serving duties. They’re great little systems but they’re designed to be cheap, not performant.
I self-host currently on a VM running on a 12 year old x86 system with 8GB RAM and with the Nextcloud file storage going over a 1Gbps NFS mount. Not exactly a high-end setup. And it performs just fine. I was previously running on a AWS EC2 instance where I noticed occasional issues running on a T4g.SMALL. (only 2GB RAM). I had to bump up to a MEDIUM at some point though.
It worked with less RAM pretty fine for a long time. But as I increased usage it would have issues occasionally. I think with all the images I have it was doing lots of processing for thumbnails and the like. I never really dove into it to see what exactly was going on though…
But still - a moderately old desktop system with 4-8G of RAM is just fine for “self-hosting”.
EDIT: I should add - I’m also hosting MariaDB on the same server - also with its data stored on an NFS share.
Nextcloud is not easy to setup, that´s right, but it is not this complicated. Use Postgres as database, it is faster than MySQL. Install Redis as Cache and configure PHP Cache too. This will speedup the most. I use nextcloud installed directly on the host, no docker. Another small guide is here for Postgres and Apache
Just want to say that I’ve been there. There was a time my Nextcloud install was incredibly slow. Fortunately (or unfortunately?), it is featureful enough and widely supported that once you figure this issue out, it is a nice service to keep running.
For me, adding Redis was essential. It doesn’t really make sense to me why (nothing I do on Nextcloud is intensive or data heavy) but it has greatly improved the performance of my app.
My entire setup is a containerized Nextcloud, Nextcloud Cron, MariaDB (if I knew Postgres was an option, I would’ve chosen that), and Redis:
version: '2' services: nextcloud: container_name: nextcloud image: nextcloud:27-apache restart: unless-stopped environment: - MYSQL_PASSWORD=nextcloud - MYSQL_HOST=db - MYSQL_DATABASE=nextcloud - MYSQL_USER=nextcloud labels: - 'public-service=true' - 'traefik.enable=true' - 'traefik.http.routers.cloud.rule=Host(`nextcloud.some.domain`)' - 'traefik.http.routers.cloud.tls=true' - 'traefik.http.services.cloud.loadbalancer.server.port=80' volumes: - /some/data/dir/nextcloud/data:/var/www/html - /some/external/dir:/wew:ro nextcloud-cron: image: nextcloud:27-apache restart: unless-stopped command: [/cron.sh] environment: - MYSQL_HOST=db - MYSQL_DATABASE=nextcloud - MYSQL_USER=nextcloud - MYSQL_PASSWORD=nextcloud volumes: - /some/data/dir/nextcloud/data:/var/www/html - /some/external/dir/:/wew:ro db: image: mariadb:10.4 restart: unless-stopped environment: MYSQL_DATABASE: nextcloud MYSQL_USER: nextcloud MYSQL_ROOT_PASSWORD: nextcloud volumes: - /some/data/dir/nextcloud/db:/var/lib/mysql mysqldump: image: mariadb:10.4 depends_on: [db] # restart: never # cronjob labels: - 'cron.schedule=0 0 8 * * ?' entrypoint: [mysqldump, -h, db, -u, nextcloud, -pnextcloud, --all-databases, -r, /out/nextcloud.sql] user: root volumes: - /some/data/dir/nextcloud/db-dump:/out redis: image: redis restart: unless-stoppedCan I ask why the separate NC container for cron? Also, I presume the mysqldump container is for easy db backups?
The separate cron container made the most sense to me. Other variants “work” but imo are mostly workarounds to avoid setting up a real cronjob. Beyond this I have no real reason, nor can I vouch that is is more or less performant than others.
Yes, the mysqldump container is for easier restores. It’s much easier to restore from a .sql file than a raw data dir that was copied while the DB was running ;) (speaking from experience…)
For what it’s worth you can convert the database to postgres if you want. I tried it out a few weeks ago and went flawlessly.
https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/latest/admin_manual/configuration_database/db_conversion.html
How is NC using redis? I can’t see any links from the NC container
I configured it in config.php directly, probably following https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/latest/admin_manual/configuration_server/caching_configuration.html#id2
'memcache.local' => '\\OC\\Memcache\\APCu', 'memcache.distributed' => '\\OC\\Memcache\\Redis', 'memcache.locking' => '\\OC\\Memcache\\Redis', 'redis' => array ( 'host' => 'redis', 'port' => 6379, ),
For speed Seafile absolutely smokes Nextcloud.
If you create an account they’ll give a pro license (limited to 3 users) for free. Or you can stick with the always free community edition which works great too.
I’m my experience, nextcloud is quite I/O bound. The performance of your storage device will greatly affect nextcloud performance. But if you’re already using SSD and the performance still bad, maybe there are other issues with your setup.
For me, speed isn’t the only issue. Everything about nc seems to be cobbled together in the most inconvenient way possible. Updates have always been hit or miss for me - and if you choose to use dockerized versions, you might as well shoot yourself, everything is very slow, even as the only use having it running on a quite capable machine it feels sluggish (not slow, but uncomfortably delayed).
It’s a glorified Dropbox clone, why do I need anything more than a rpi1 for that?
I have nextcloud running on docker on a Raspberry Pi 4 and I’d say the performance is comparable to Onedrive web interface. If you’re getting timeouts then something must be wrong with the setup, not the machine it’s running on. Using Postgres instead of MySQL or using an SSD instead of HDD is not going to help your issue.
Nextcloud is hard to install in manual way (even sometimes with Docker). As far I know, both Snap and Yunohost versions of Nextcloud are solid. I used Snap version on the cheapest Linode VPS, and it worked fine, especially when I doubled the SWAP to 1 GB. Now I use Yunohost version and I have only good time with it. It is super stable, fast and reliable. I used Nextcloud_ynh on HP 800 Mini G3 with i5-6500t and now on Asrock Mini PC with Ryzen 7 5700g. It is working just great.
If you don’t want to use Nextcloud, you ca install Vikunja for kanban and tasks. For notes Hedgedoc can be great.
I run Nextcloud, its responsive and has all my stuff in it. Notes, Calendar, Contacts, Kanboard, Photos, RSS reader, others. You do need look at the setup, how many PHP processes are you running, how much memory does MySQL use.
My current setup is a a PHP vm, 6 cores and 8GB of memory and a MySQL vm that is 2 cores and 8GB memory. But I work for a SaaS provider and thats now we carve up our systems, a vm/instance for 1 job.
how many PHP processes
Curious: where do I set this number?
Nginx is supported and a good choice. What database are you using? I’d recommend MariaDB.
Nginx alone will not speed up Nextcloud. Use Postgres instead of MySQL and configure Redis and PHP Cache. This will speed up most. And Nginx is not officially support, see here
The documentation says nginx is not officially supported: https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/19/admin_manual/installation/nginx.html
I am using mariadb
Ah right, sorry; the company doesn’t support it directly but the docs provide an example. To me as tinkerer that was solid enough 😂😅
Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I’ve seen in this thread:
Fewer Letters More Letters AP WiFi Access Point HTTP Hypertext Transfer Protocol, the Web NUC Next Unit of Computing brand of Intel small computers RPi Raspberry Pi brand of SBC SATA Serial AT Attachment interface for mass storage SBC Single-Board Computer SSD Solid State Drive mass storage VPS Virtual Private Server (opposed to shared hosting) nginx Popular HTTP server
7 acronyms in this thread; the most compressed thread commented on today has 9 acronyms.
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Go for the AllinOne (AIO) Installation! Had huge performance issues first (Nextcloudpi Docker & normal Nextcloud Docker) and none with the current install.
You get a self servicing (updates/installation/etc.) docker install with backups and administration portal.
From the instructions it looked like anything other than the default ports is not supported in AIO. I want to host other sites on this server without much complication.
So use a reverse proxy like Nginx Proxy Manager
Yes, a reverse proxy can fix this issue.
Pydio and Seafile are alternatives I’ve tried. Pydio was pretty fast too. I agree with you on Nextcloud, I want to like it but I inevitably start having issues and it’s slow even after tuning. It just tries to do too much and shouldn’t be that complex to spin up a file server.
To be honest I’m not interested in the file sharing side of nextcloud as I use Syncthing, I’m more interested in the utilities (eg notes, kanban) and the office capabilities. I want to replace gsuite
I guess you are doing something very wrong if you have such performance trouble all the time.
The Pi (up to 4) is known for bad disk I/O. Look into this area first.
I am running my nc on a weak old low power deskop CPU (and with real SATA harddisks) and only when I ask for long running jobs (like, create the previews and icons for 200 new photos) I can watch any slow responses at all.
I’m not using a Pi, I’m using a j4125 based mini computer, which has made a big difference but the performance just still is not good enough.
It runs quite nicely on my Pi 3 with Apache and no Docker. I only use cloud storage, but the rest seems to work fine if needed. Maybe switching to a supported configuration would help?
