• v01dworks@lemmy.world
    43·
    3 days ago

    lol I was so confused by Firefox not needing to restart that I tried running update again and then closed it myself because I thought something went wrong

  • macniel@feddit.org
    183·
    4 days ago

    that forced restart is probably going to be a huge win for our rolling release brothers and sisters.

    • Ephera@lemmy.mlEnglish
      442·
      4 days ago

      I believe, Firefox bugfix releases get rolled out pretty quickly on most non-rolling distros, too, so I don’t think it’s a terribly different experience, unless you’re on a distro with Firefox ESR, like e.g. Debian.

      • AugustWest@lemmy.world
        6·
        4 days ago

        Can you expand on this a little for a new guy who is considering a switch from Mint to Debian?

        In my understanding Firefox ESR is like a stable, longstanding version that doesn’t get frequent little updates but still gets occasional large updates. (Like 1.0, 1.1, etc. rather than 1.0, 1.0.1, 1.0.2, etc.)

        Is there a measurable difference in the user experience and or security of ESR?

        And is Debian actually restricted to ESR?

        • Ephera@lemmy.mlEnglish
          15·
          4 days ago

          Sure. Here’s a high-level page which I’ll be kind of going off of: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/choosing-firefox-update-channel

          But basically, Firefox ESR (“Extended Support Release”) means that you still get security fixes in a timely manner, but feature updates are delayed. Firefox normally gets feature updates every 4 weeks, whereas ESR averages one (larger) feature update per year. You might know such a model as LTS (“Long-Term Support”) release from other software.

          Essentially, the current ‘normal’ Firefox version is 141.0, whereas the ESR version is 128.13.0.
          Mozilla does maintain a separate changelog for ESR, but basically it’s as if from 129.0 onwards, you only included the “Fixed”, none of the “New” or “Changed” stuff.

          The next ESR will be based off of Firefox 140, as can be seen in their release calendar, so this change that OP praises here will not make it into ESR for another year or so.

          And then you gotta also pay the Debian toll, which is that they won’t upgrade to the newest ESR right away either. 😅
          Mozilla actually still maintains the Firefox ESR based on version 115, which is about to be discontinued with the new ESR major release.
          Debian will typically maintain the ESR even beyond that (Firefox is open-source, so they can retrofit patches themselves), because they have an even longer support lifecycle for their OS release. But I believe, if you always upgrade to the newest Debian release as they make them available, you should be covered by the Mozilla-supported ESR at all times.

          If you do not want to pay the Debian toll (not just for Firefox, but any software where you care about new features), then Flatpaks are typically the solution of choice. It’s a different way of installing software, which allows you to get the newest version, independent from what Debian is doing.

          But back to the normal Debian experience. How does it affect the user experience for Firefox? Well, we’ve already covered that others may be happy about new features when you’ve gotta take solace in your disgustingly stable software.
          These feature updates also include the newest support for web standards, so it’s theoretically possible that a webpage doesn’t work right in ESR. In practice, I don’t think this happens very often, because webdevs can’t use the newest web standards right away anyways. There’s always gonna be users on old browsers or there’s whole browsers which don’t support the new stuff right away.

          How does it affect security? Generally, ESR is secure. Occasionally, the feature updates might introduce security-relevant stuff, too, like when they switched to the multi-process architecture, that brought along much better isolation and you can’t just retrofit that into ESR. But yeah, this isn’t the norm. You shouldn’t be particularly worried about security. You do get the normal patches in a timely manner.

          Well, and to infodump a little more, you could also take a look at Linux Mint Debian Edition. It’s Linux Mint, but instead of Ubuntu underneath, it’s Debian underneath.
          Ubuntu is actually itself based on Debian, so I’ve heard LMDE described as “What does basing it on Ubuntu even add? LMDE feels exactly the same as normal Linux Mint.”.
          Of course, if you’re switching because you want to try something different, that would be counterproductive. 🫠

          • AugustWest@lemmy.world
            5·
            4 days ago

            Thanks so much for the informative and detailed reply. That pretty much answers every question.

            Thanks also for the tip about LMDE. I actually really like Mint, I’m only switching because it’s the only distro I’ve tried and I feel like I should shop around a bit. Going to Debian because while starting my journey I want to shop around with things that work, rather than having to learn how to tinker all at once just to get things running. But if I decide I need Mint back I’ll probably check out LMDE for the hell of it.

        • whosepoopisonmybutt@sh.itjust.works
          6·
          4 days ago

          I don’t know how the timing of each release is planned but the Firefox website gives instructions for using the repositories for esr, beta, nightly, or dev edition.

          Using Debian as your distro doesn’t lock you into firefox ESR.

    • cygnus@lemmy.ca
      14·
      4 days ago

      Why? I already reboot daily because everything gets updated so much. (I’m into that)

          • DonutsRMeh@lemmy.world
            9·
            4 days ago

            I think some servers have an actual DE and all. If I remember correctly, I’ve seen centos with gnome.

            • FauxLiving@lemmy.world
              5·
              4 days ago

              I installed a DE on my server, I just disable sddm unless I need to do something in a web browser on that machine. I haven’t needed to yet, but I have it just in case.

        • cygnus@lemmy.ca
          2·
          3 days ago

          I run Ubuntu Server on my server, but on my computer I want updates as soon as humanly possible.

        • randint@lemmy.frozeninferno.xyzEnglish
          3·
          4 days ago

          Very true. I used to poweroff my laptop every day, but now, after getting into servers, I sometimes leave my laptop up overnight (even though the laptop isn’t the server)

      • ayyy@sh.itjust.works
        2·
        4 days ago

        I’ve got a super ignorant question; Is the situation with session saving on Linux desktop environments with default settings finally locked in enough that you literally can’t tell when a reboot has happened once the session is restored? Including user space apps? _Redacted_OS has been so good at this for so long that I literally don’t think about uptime on my daily driver anymore.

        • Nalivai@lemmy.world
          4·
          3 days ago

          I’m on KDE and I’m not doing anything special regarding this, and for me the answer to this question “somewhat”. I specifically hate when apps are starting by themselves so they don’t do for me and I’m happy about it. But when I turn on most apps that I use they open in the state I closed them in.

        • jumping_redditor@sh.itjust.works
          0·
          3 days ago

          no, at least not if you’re doing anything with poorly supported hardware with it’s own configuration tools that reset when it loses power (it is powered when the computer is on but sometimes stays powered through reboots)

    • AusatKeyboardPremi@lemmy.world
      82·
      4 days ago

      Why?

      Does one reboot their entire system after updating Firefox on Linux?

      I never do. I don’t even restart Firefox after updating, if it is already running.

      • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
        32·
        4 days ago

        I never do. I don’t even restart Firefox after updating, if it is already running.

        Clearly you don’t use it often, firefox will force you to restart itself and refuse to render webpages.

          • boonhet@sopuli.xyz
            10·
            3 days ago

            Linux machines?

            Because on my Linux machines, once it’s been updated, I can not open a new tab, it’ll tell me to frig off and restart. I can click links in existing tabs, and might’ve been possible to enter a new URL in an existing tab, I don’t recall exactly.

      • Ephera@lemmy.mlEnglish
        8·
        3 days ago

        On Linux:

        • an application’s files can be updated while the application is running, and
        • there’s an OS-wide updater (i.e. package manager) with which you can update most software, including Firefox. (You can also get Firefox with its built-in auto-updater, but most people prefer the OS-wide updater.)

        Both of these are good things. But Firefox, with its relatively advanced multi-process architecture, had a problem here, because it could happen that its files got updated while it was running and then when it started a new process, this new process might be incompatible with the old processes, therefore unable to communicate correctly.

        Their initial solution was to force you to quit Firefox and reopen it, when they detected that the files had changed and you did something in Firefox which might need a new process, so primarily when opening a new tab.

        I’m guessing, they now implemented a way to launch the new process by still using the old files from before the update.

  • Lucy :3@feddit.org
    64·
    4 days ago

    WHAT??? ALL OF THOSE FEATURES HAVE BEEN IN NIGHTLY FOR A MONTH AND I STILL ALWAYS RESTART IT OUT OF HABIT! IT’S LITERALLY PART OF MY ROUTINE AND NOW YOU TELL ME IT DOESN’T NEED TO BE ANYMORE?

    • FauxLiving@lemmy.world
      74·
      4 days ago

      Watch out, we got a badass over here. Running a nightly build and not reading the patch notes, so brave.

        • FauxLiving@lemmy.world
          8·
          4 days ago

          Oh yeah, I live dangerously too. If it breaks, I can fix it and the total effort of fixing the random problems that happen is less than I would spend reading patch notes.

          But, we got newbies here and we gotta teach 'em right from wrong.

          • Lucy :3@feddit.org
            3·
            4 days ago

            99% of problems I have with arch testing can be resolved by simply downgrading a package, if I can’t fix it by any other means

          • Lucy :3@feddit.org
            21·
            4 days ago

            Why tho? I never complained about the way it is, I use testing/nightly/beta/alpha everywhere and I rarely have problems. Also with FF. I was more ranting about myself not realizing that the requirement was gone, considering I, multiple times, upgraded and then e.g. opened a few tabs after, which usually prompted for a restart. And in the end, it’s not gonna change anything, as the point of nightly is to catch any bugs and instabilities, which would very likely only occur after a restart of FF.

  • cmhe@lemmy.world
    201·
    3 days ago

    Good to know that I am not the only one mistaking Cr1TiKaL aka MoistCr1TiKaL aka penguinz0 aka Charles Christopher White Jr. as Asmongold aka Zack Hoyt (the rightwing influencer).

  • hazel@lemmy.blahaj.zoneEnglish
    29·
    4 days ago

    Charlie’s still using that gamer version of Opera though. With the fake key stroke sounds enabled.

  • ozymandias117@lemmy.worldEnglish
    461·
    4 days ago

    Getting rid of that forced restart will at least help me personally stay more secure and get bug fixes faster

  • henfredemars@infosec.pubEnglish
    34·
    4 days ago

    How was memory use actually reduced? I read several articles on this, but I didn’t see anyone talking about how they achieved this.

  • Phoenixz@lemmy.ca
    18·
    4 days ago

    I swear to God, if I ever have to restart my Firefox again because snap without asking updated Firefox again in secret, I’m going to fucking lose it…

  • glitchdx@lemmy.worldEnglish
    116·
    3 days ago

    …

    I miss the days when it was normal to just shut down the pc when you were done with it. Leaving things on all of the time isn’t healthy.

    • thermal_shock@lemmy.worldEnglish
      4·
      2 days ago

      Fully disagree. Just leave it on, restart it once every 7-10 days if you’re using windows. Linux, reboot when it asks, could be months.

    • Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de
      6·
      3 days ago

      When I finish what I want to do on my PC, I type “yay” enjoy text and pacmans going left to right, press enter some times, and type sudo pw some times.
      After that I reboot to check, that I am not stuck in TTY and turn off after

    • seralth@lemmy.worldEnglish
      142·
      3 days ago

      It’s healthier for the hardware to just leave it running then turning it off and on all the time.

      We ain’t in the days of mechanical moving parts anymore. Idle time is way less of a problem then power ons.

    • stoy@lemmy.zip
      3·
      3 days ago

      I leave my work machine on constantly, but am very careful and shut down my home machine when I go to bed.

      It just feels wrong to leave it powered up.

    • Aimeeloulm@feddit.uk
      5·
      3 days ago

      I always turn computer off when done, it never sleeps or hibernates, no need since I’m either using it or not, through been leaving it on 24/7 at moment due to wiping some hard drives which takes time, so it’s working which is fine 😬

    • halcyoncmdr@lemmy.worldEnglish
      413·
      4 days ago

      Just restarting Firefox, not the entire system.

      Which doesn’t really matter for 99.99% of users that are sane and only use a couple windows and tabs at a time. Saving things they aren’t actively using anymore as bookmarks and using the browsing history for anything they closed previously but need again.

      For the 0.01% of insane but vocal users that never close tabs and/or keep dozens of windows open, that’s a big deal.

  • Sidhean@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    41·
    3 days ago

    to be fair, i thought asmongold and penguinz0 were the same person, and that cr1tikal was a seperate, equally shit-headed person. My poor brain-- so the “woo lets go baby” guy is a decent dude? and its the other guy that has a rat corpse alarm clock? or am i still confused?

      • dustyData@lemmy.world
        1·
        2 days ago

        The differences are astonishing Asmongold is pretty much a gaming and bad takes second hand streamer. Whose only identity is kissing right wing politician’s ass, even when they actively hate and attack him.

        Then Charlie is there with movie and music credits, anime and comics productions, podcasts, business ventures, and also streaming. With every single of his political takes and controversies being morally and ethically sound and consistent.

        They are like Superman and bizarro, mirror images of each other, similar but opposites at the same time.

        Oh, and asswithmold face is the most punchable face on the internet (second only to PirateSoftware’s) while Charlie’s is sculpted by the gods themselves.