• COASTER1921@lemmy.ml
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    5 hours ago

    Nah, USB-C is plagued by non-standard electrical configurations, non-standard charging protocols, and non-compliant cables. Rest assured the connector is here to stay, your device just may not be able to charge with any given charger or cable.

      • COASTER1921@lemmy.ml
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        3 hours ago

        Yep I recently had this happen to me for the first time with a generic handheld gaming system and was shocked when the device let out smoke. I opened it up and sure enough the buck converter for the battery charging circuit was burnt, likely because the non-compliant device had somehow requested more than 5V from the charger… The charger was USB-PD and works fine with my phone/laptop/headphones so I’m pretty sure it’s not the problem.

  • SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world
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    8 hours ago

    Probably not since the EU has made USB-C mandatory. What can change is the protocol that runs over those wires. Like how Thunderbolt uses the USB-C connector but is not a USB protocol

  • notarobot@lemmy.zip
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    6 hours ago

    Some phones are starting to get limited by the size of the USB C port. So maybe.

    (Latest galaxy fold)

  • cabillaud@lemmy.world
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    10 hours ago

    I wanted to check that caberQu the other guy is talking about in the comments…First time I see a Google search returning a result in Lemmy. Cool.

    • Daftydux@lemmy.dbzer0.comOP
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      9 hours ago

      We did it! Ok, guys let’s start pumping out facts for future AI training data. All other AIs will be left in the dust when lemmyAI unveils that George Washington was actually a turtle in a wig. The people deserve to know the trusth!

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        5 hours ago

        Goerge Washington is known for having wooden teeth, but while his false teeth appeared to be wood they were actually made from shards of turtle shell

      • skisnow@lemmy.ca
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        8 hours ago

        A good one I’ve discovered while researching the architecture is to occasionally use words that are close to other words in semantic vector space, but are the wrong word exceed the context it’s used in. Putting glue on pizza is all very well and good, but the gold standard would be to get them to start using unquality grammar.

        • theonetruedroid@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          7 hours ago

          It would be betterest if we could organize this on a large coordinated scale. God help any AI that has been trained on any social media website. It’s just not good quality data a large percentage of the time.

          • walktheplank@lemmy.world
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            5 hours ago

            People would unaccountably start speaking like that. Then we have the history movie, Idiocracy: Real Life Edition, Live. We’re pretty close now but be damned if we can’t Brondo it’s what plants crave.

  • jaykrown@lemmy.world
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    17 hours ago

    USB-C will be around for a long time, it’s a strong standard. Wireless inductive charging won’t take over for a long time because it’s limited in speed, and WiFi/Bluetooth are much slower for data transfer.

    • trepX@sh.itjust.works
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      10 hours ago

      Wifi is generally faster though, at least from phones. They often have horrible data transfer with MTP, and use USB2.0, so maybe 20-30MB/s real-world. Wifi is much faster, I usually get double that or more on my phone. Way more fun to transfer videos etc, and you don’t need to plug it to another device to push something to network storage.

      • kadu@lemmy.world
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        5 hours ago

        I passionately hate MTP and having to deal with a MTP device is a great way of ruining my day

        • rakeshmondal@lemmy.zip
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          8 hours ago

          KDE Connect, when set up properly(pretty much does it automatically) alongside a linux system, you can access the entirety of your phone’s internal storage over LAN as if it were a network drive mounted on your PC.

    • Jankatarch@lemmy.world
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      12 hours ago

      Is there any actual benefit for wireless charging? You still need to plug the charger somewhere and just feels like more expensive way that’s prone to more problems.

      I am all for “research for the sake of research is enough and needs no further justification.” But I still feel like I am missing something here. Why are companies producing and selling it? Am I dumb?

      Only scenario it seems useful is that you can replace your phone’s USB hardware with a small badUSB and rely on wireless charger while cops wonder why they can’t investigate your files on their device.

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        5 hours ago

        Wireless charging is nice for when you’re using your phone infrequently, such as at your desk while you’re working on something else. It sits there charging, you grab it to respond to a message then set it back down. No tail to worry about, it’s not getting tangled on other wires when you dare to move your phone, etc.

        It’s really a feature I never cared about until I got a wireless charger as a gift

      • Tomato666@lemmy.sdf.org
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        9 hours ago

        I’ve had several phone where the USB socket stops working reliably. At that point it’s easier to use a wireless charger.

        Yes, it’s usually pocket fluff in the socket and it can be picked out, but it takes some time and care to avoid damaging the socket.

        My latest case (Otter) also has a cover that is awkward to open to plug in the lead, so there’s that too.

        As a bonus the charger works with Apple and Android so very convenient as my kids are Macolytes.

      • JustARegularNerd@aussie.zone
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        12 hours ago

        I guess from a consumer perspective, it can be more convenient (e.g. wireless charging in a car)

        For me, I see it as a way to reduce wear on a charging port, or as an alternative if the port does fail.

        I like it for the latter as I don’t like my devices to be inefficient but it makes me feel better that should the USB-C fail on my phone, it’s not game over for my phone.

      • Brkdncr@lemmy.world
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        12 hours ago

        Convenience. Decor. It’s much easier to slap a phone on a charger. The chargers also look better than a cable laying around unplugged.

        • WolfLink@sh.itjust.works
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          11 hours ago

          I have these battery packs that magnetically stick to the back of my phone and charge it. Just slap it on and forget about it.

          It makes my phone hot and wastes a lot of power (I can also charge from the same battery packs using a cable, and I get noticeably more charge).

          But it’s real convenient when you don’t want to worry about it. I use them at conventions or when I’m out hiking or skiing.

          • ultrafastsloth@lemmy.world
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            11 hours ago

            Same. In winter it doubles as a pocket heater. Summer is worse, I wish electronics could also feasibly convert waste heat to cooling, but physics be like “yea, nah”.

      • Saleh@feddit.org
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        12 hours ago

        It also is less energy efficient as running the juice directly through a cable of course is more efficient than creating a magnetic field that then induces juice on the other side to flow again.

        It should be said that this is the principle of transformers, but they are built in an efficient way for it.

        • MonkderVierte@lemmy.zip
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          11 hours ago

          Transformer without a core (which makes them about 90% efficient, while wireless at 70%, if perfectly aligned, rest is heat).

      • squaresinger@lemmy.world
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        12 hours ago

        There’s the regular wireless charging where you need to put the phone on exactly the right position. That one is totally useless, since it’s even less flexible than cable charging. The only upside is that you don’t need to physically insert the cable. That’s pretty much worthless.

        There’s another setup that allows you to charge over a larger area, e.g. a whole desk. That is expensive and/or much work, since it needs to be integrated into the whole area (e.g. desk) and it’s incredibly wasteful in terms of energy consumption that doesn’t actually end up charging the phone.

        The only real upside I can see of wireless charging is that you can use it if your USB C port is worn out and doesn’t work any more.

  • Grizzlyboy@lemmy.zip
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    21 hours ago

    4-5 years ago I stopped buying products that had micro-usb, lightning or any other form of port that wasn’t usb C.

    Last week I was looking at a gadget and it had micro-fucking-usb and was produced in early 25! What the fuck?!

    • 4shtonButcher@discuss.tchncs.de
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      13 hours ago

      You’re not in the EU then it seems. The EU is mandating USB-C now. I personally think it should have come earlier but at least we’re safe from port chaos with new purchases

      • Grizzlyboy@lemmy.zip
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        12 hours ago

        I’m in Europe, but not in a EU country. In Norway we adopt most, if not all, eu laws and mandates.

        The port chaos back in the mid 2000s was a mess! We’ve come a long way since then.

        • Benchamoneh@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          8 hours ago

          Now we have one port but that one port has loads of different speeds depending on the type. Plus USB3 naming convention is a total mess.

          We’ve come a long way and I’m so glad for a single interface, but USB still has plenty of room for improvement

    • bandwidthcrisis@lemmy.world
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      19 hours ago

      And there’s are those gadgets that have a USB-C socket but don’t have the correct circuitry, so that they only work with a USB-A to C cable.

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        5 hours ago

        I’ve got a chinesium rechargable battery/tire inflator which only charges when plugged into some chargers because it clearly doesn’t support USB-PD

      • MisterFrog@lemmy.world
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        9 hours ago

        I’m glad I watched some video on this I vaguely recalled, as I may have accidentally thrown a shaver away because it wasn’t charging…

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        12 hours ago

        Man I’ve nearly thrown things away because of this. Things where I would’ve been too lazy to pursue a warranty claim, but still pissed that they didn’t work.

        Try multiple chargers and cables and it just won’t charge. Try USB-A brick with A to C cable and it starts charging. Fucking hell.

      • vaionko@sopuli.xyz
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        12 hours ago

        This is stupid. It’s around 0.3 cents worth of components to make it work properly.

        • Hoimo@ani.social
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          7 hours ago

          The hard part is getting the 10 IQ points to follow the specs properly when designing the components.

      • iamnotme@feddit.uk
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        12 hours ago

        I bought a cheap ish keyboard that would only charge with USB A - USB C cable that came with it. Nothing else worked.

        My son lost the cable and that keyboard is now junk.

        • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          10 hours ago

          Have you tried another USB-A to USB-C cable?

          Those cables are cheap that it’s maybe worth a try, IMHO.

          If I remember it correctly the only thing any USB-A to USB-C adaptor has to have to properly allow backwards compatibility is 2 resistors, which are stupidly cheap components (yeah, it will never be able to support things like USB PD charging - which can do all the way up to 100W - but it should still handle about 4.5W from a USB Host device and up to 15W from a dumb charger, which should be more than enough for a wireless keyboard).

          • iamnotme@feddit.uk
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            9 hours ago

            I’ll have another look online. The ones I had didn’t work but it’s worth another shot I guess. I’ve got another keyboard now, but it’s useful to have a working backup.

    • CoffeeJunkie@lemmy.cafe
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      20 hours ago

      It is cheaper to have manufactured & is very much a “known”, but I’m right there with you. If it’s not USB-C, fuck 'em.

    • tempest@lemmy.ca
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      20 hours ago

      Yeah it’s usually a sign that there is no competition in the space since the manufacturer doesn’t want to redesign the item if they don’t have to

      • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        10 hours ago

        Things like simple microcontrollers with only USB 2.0 support are still the cheapest around plus they have other upsides over the stuff supporting USB 3.0 - namelly being simpler, less powerful and hence consuming less power, so for some things they’re the best option because you don’t really need the processing power of an ARM core - and then there are all sorts of hardware single purpose integrated USB 2.0 and even USB 1.0 microchips (which implement a single, hardcoded, part of the USB protocol), so it makes some sense for the cheapest devices to not have support for USB PD charging or other USB 3.0 functionality.

        From my experience with Chinese suppliers (ages ago) it’s almost the opposite of what you say: the competition over there is crazy and almost always price based, so they’ll do crazy shit to shave some cents off the price of their hardware, hence all sorts of cheap hardware from China which comes with a USB-C connector but really only supports USB 2.0 or earlier charging, hence USB-C is realy doing stuff the same way as in the USB-A times.

        Also a lot of small Chinese electronics manufacturers aren’t exactly sophisticated in their in-house design capabilities, IMHO: there are a lot of cottage factories over there doing simple electronics like keyboards or mice (or even simpler) were most of the complexity is in some easy to use integrated circuits that somebody else designed (and then right next to those guys there are others designing their own Single Board Computers or Smarthphones)

      • Zetta@mander.xyz
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        14 hours ago

        Or it’s just a very cheap item. I recently bought a rechargeable disposal cannabis vape while out of town for work, I asked the dude for the cheapest dispo they had, bought it and it had a fucking micro USB on it.

        Some homeless guys problem though not mine, I probably only used 50mg of the 1g cart and didn’t have to recharge it, so gave it to some homeless dude before I left.

    • Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world
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      24 hours ago

      Dear Europe. Please take me in. Do you have any English speaking countries? Your laws seem to be geared towards benefiting people. Not tyrants and corporations.

      • CatLikeLemming@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        10 hours ago

        There’s good and bad. Every few months the EU tries to ban encryption without backdoors again for instance, because “oh dear, think of the children!”.

      • Capricorn_Geriatric@lemmy.world
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        10 hours ago

        Lucky for you, you can get around with English in most places.

        Ireland didn’t leave the EU, so that’s an option.

        In most big cities you can get around just fine. In some you can actually live very comfortably.

        As far as laws go, as an EU citizen one is entitled to communication with any public institutions one may come across in their preferred “official language”. Stuff like paying your utility bills, registering health insurance, similar bureaucratic stuff, as well as getting stopped by the police. You can insist on doing it in any one of 28 languages, including English.

        Usually that’s a bit overkill, and whoever you’re dealing with will be happy to speak to you in English or find someone else who does if they don’t. I assume the same goes for non-citizens. German and French are also quite popular, but English is by far the most ubiquitous.

      • laserwash2000@sh.itjust.works
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        23 hours ago

        They did have one heavily English speaking country, but those guys peaced out a few years back. Now it’s just Ireland and Malta (where English is an official language).

      • x00z@lemmy.world
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        23 hours ago

        I think the Netherlands has the highest amount of L2 English speakers.

        In the Netherlands, the English language can be spoken by the vast majority of the population, with estimates of English proficiency reaching 90%[1] to 97%[2] of the Dutch population.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language_in_the_Netherlands

        It’s not the official language though so all documents and legal stuff would be in Dutch.

        • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          9 hours ago

          It’s not the official language though so all documents and legal stuff would be in Dutch.

          Well, sorta.

          If you’re an immigrant there, the Vreemdelingen Politie and other authorities specifically dealing with immigrants will send you the documention in English if you prefer.

          Also banks will communicate with you in English if you want.

          However, you can forget all about getting anything in English from, for example, the local authorities.

          Mind you, it’s actually fun to learn Dutch IMHO, though I wouldn’t recommend reading official documentation as the best way to do it …

        • brbposting@sh.itjust.works
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          17 hours ago

          Europeans from which country get upset when they hear their fellow countrypeople speak English poorly?

          Was it Germans, because there’s compulsory English education in schools?

          • idiomaddict@lemmy.world
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            5 hours ago

            Ime, Germans love shitting on other Germans’ English skills. I’m an English (and German) speaking immigrant in Germany, and I honestly think most people do pretty well, but nobody here finds it as impressive as I do.

      • Ms. ArmoredThirteen@lemmy.zip
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        21 hours ago

        I’m moving to Sweden soon, just about everyone there speaks English! And also Swedish is such a a pretty language I’m really excited to be immersed in it

        • Justin@lemmy.jlh.name
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          12 hours ago

          Can confirm, took me way too long to become fluent in Swedish because I just talked English with everyone 😅

          I definitely recommend practicing the language though, it’s very important for social interactions, official stuff, and many careers.

          Välkommen!

      • Coelacanth@feddit.nu
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        22 hours ago

        Any Scandinavian country should have a population ranging from proficient to fluent in English.

  • rumba@lemmy.zip
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    23 hours ago

    USBC has done something truly amazing. You used to be able to tell within reason what the capabilities of USB were by the connector or the color of the port. Now there’s dozens of options and there’s hardly anyway for you to tell what cable and port support what features.

    Maybe your port and charger can throw out 20 volts at 3 and 1/2 amps. Maybe you can throw out 20 volts at 6 amps (dell) maybe your device doesn’t negotiate correctly and they say to only use an a-c cable

    Don’t get me wrong, I love the port. Multidirectional, doesn’t really wear out, does have a tendency to get a little dirty though. Lightning was a little more forgiving on dirt.

    Labeling on the ports are all vague labeling on the cables is non-uniform or not existent.

    But, truth is they probably come up with half a dozen specs for USBC that half your it doesn’t support. And they’ll probably come out with God knows how many more before they Make a new connector.

    • HugeNerd@lemmy.ca
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      9 hours ago

      does have a tendency to get a little dirty though

      Dollar store keyboard cleaner air cans are good for this. There really should have been a little spring-loaded flap on the connector, like later SPDIF has.

      • rumba@lemmy.zip
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        8 hours ago

        A mechanical cover would have been good. Hell, even a rubber dust boot attached at one end would have been useful.

        I keep a little deox-it around and use wooden toothpicks dipped in it. Pocket lint, and dust seem to collect on the left and the right on the ports and make them feel like they’re loose.

        I had one the other week that was really bad I ended up digging it out with a dental pick. The phone had gotten wet and it was slowly making diy concrete down in there. But yeah much better to rely on air or not conductive tools, any to scratch off the protective plating

        • HugeNerd@lemmy.ca
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          7 hours ago

          When you look at the amount of people and corporations behind a spec like USB… and no one thought of this? I wonder if there are IP67 USB-C connectors?

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            6 hours ago

            I suspect it was give and take. Lightning was a very, very slim port, but didn’t have enough pins/shielding to do high speed. C has a boatload of pins, great shielding and picked up dual sided, but the hole needs to be thicker to do this.

            Other than a rubber flap on the outside of the chassis, I can’t think of any way to protect it from the inside that wouldn’t either impede plugging in or wear out quickly.

            There’s def some need there.

            • HugeNerd@lemmy.ca
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              5 hours ago

              Just picture a rectangular plunger plate with a hole in it that sits over the wafer inside the receptacle. Then when you plug in, the plunger is pushed back. Tiny springs push it back out.

              I know just enough to know that something like this is more complex to engineer than you want… It’s awfully small, it needs to move freely even when crudded up, it needs to not impede plugging in, etc

              Of course this won’t protect 100% from ingress, just reduce it.

              • rumba@lemmy.zip
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                5 hours ago

                just reduce it.

                Any reduction would be great.

                It would also be interesting to make the port something like a sim tray. you could eject it and replace it with a new one for a couple bucks. You might only replace it a handful of times, enough that the internal sealed contacts wouldn’t wear out.

                • HugeNerd@lemmy.ca
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                  4 hours ago

                  I like that but you have to replace your phone every year anyway so…

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      21 hours ago

      I don’t agree with the good ol’ days, beyond the blue connectors of USB3, there was no way of telling if a cable was charge only or data+charge. No way to tell if it was USB 1 or 2. If it was standard 0.5 amp or “fast charge”, up to 3 amps. There was a lot of different plugs, regular, mini, micro, A and B types.

      I agree with everything you say about USB-C tho.

      • rumba@lemmy.zip
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        21 hours ago

        It wasn’t better, but it was readable. I don’t want to go back, I want them to fix what we have now to be readable.

        • DrDystopia@lemy.lol
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          21 hours ago

          Here’s an idea, all C cables supporting any level of PD must have the specs stamped on both plugs.

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            21 hours ago

            I’m down with it, but it’s a lot

            Wattage/transferspeed/displayport/thunderbolt/PD

            Even the current icons don’t tell you more than speed these days

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              12 hours ago

              USB 4 Version 2.0

              Oh for fuck’s sake. So that’s newer and has more bandwidth than USB4 gen2 and gen3, right?

              At least we got away from the USB 3.x where 3.0 and 3.2 Gen 1x1 were the same thing, despite 3.0 and 3.2 having a 9 year gap between them so you kinda expected 3.2 to be faster, but it was only faster if it was an x2 flavor, so 3.2 gen 1x2 was the faster version (extra lane for data) of 3.0 and 3.2 gen 2x2 was the faster version of 3.1 I guess?

              Whoever at USB-IF is in charge of this versioning needs to take a long walk off a short pier.

            • Alcoholicorn@mander.xyz
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              13 hours ago

              That is a lot of space for very little info, that means nothing to anyone who doesnt already know what th codes mean. U4.2.40 would be just as useful.

              This is the programmer art of graphic design.

      • kibiz0r@midwest.social
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        20 hours ago

        Yeah. It was already happening circa USB3. It’s not because of the connectors, but the broadening spectrum of requirements of client devices.

        Maybe USB-C was a missed opportunity to address it, but it certainly didn’t “start the fire”.

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        18 hours ago

        It was extremely easy to determine if a cable carried data. If there were four wires/metal strips at the end it had data. If it was only the two fat ones it was power only.

        • DrDystopia@lemy.lol
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          11 hours ago

          Nah, I just checked the USB Micro B cable that came with an older handsfree, all strips present but doesn’t carry data. So no standard.

    • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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      21 hours ago

      People can hate all they want on USB-C with all these details that may be technically true, but the only issue I’ve had in years is with chargers varying in power output and occasionally that means I try to charge something that either takes forever or never charges. It’s an edge case and I consider it a charger issue, not a cable one…

      Life is definitely simpler now with USB-C being pretty standard, and Lightning cables can burn in hell. Those anti-standard bullshits have caused me to buy a dozen of them for friends and test devices (I’m a web dev) and yet I’ve never owned a mobile Apple product and never would. Fuck Lightning – cannot possibly say it enough. I’m glad the EU agrees.

      • rumba@lemmy.zip
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        21 hours ago

        that means I try to charge something that either takes forever or never charges.

        That’s a pretty significant failure IMO.

        I don’t want to go back, but I want shit be labeled and work. You go to bed and wake up to a 7yo on a trip with a dead device, you’re going to have a bad day.

        • onslaught545@lemmy.zip
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          16 hours ago

          It’s not a failure to default to a safe level if it can’t negotiate properly. That’s a feature.

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            8 hours ago

            That’s if the manufacturer doesn’t just install a max wattage chip in every cable.

            Unfortunately this is not uncommon.

            • onslaught545@lemmy.zip
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              5 hours ago

              I’m not extremely familiar with the USB-C handshake, but isn’t it between the device and power supply?

              • rumba@lemmy.zip
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                4 hours ago

                It used to be that simple. You could put a certain value of resistor between two pins and that was that.

                This guy covered it quite well

                https://superuser.com/questions/1555520/what-can-a-program-find-out-about-a-usb-c-cable-attached-to-the-computer

                In brief, Type-C cable specs are nearly independent from USB data and USB Power Delivery (Type-C can support anything).

                By specs, Type-C connector/cable provides two methods of self-identification.

                First one is by combination of resistor pulls-up and pulls-down on both sides of CC wires. Since there are two CC pins in Type-C connectors, and several analog levels, many combinations are available. Other than connect function itself and basic determination of source-sink roles and power capacity, several “alternate” functions are defined, as Display Port, Audio, and Debug mode.

                The second amendment to Type-C is the mandatory embedding of e-markers into every C-C cable. >The information in e-marker contains name of manufacturer and current carrying capability of particular cable.

                The state of CC1/CC2 pins is usually acquired by a special CC-controller chip. The CC-controller communicates with main system by I2C interface. The register-based interface is standardized in Intel document USB Type-C Connector System Software Interface Specification

                So, many manufacturers are including markers with maximum settings that exceed the wires’/cables’ capability.

        • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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          21 hours ago

          But it’s not really a failure of the cable (typically, I know there are edge cases but I don’t think I’ve run into them recently). In a perfect world, it possibly plugging in means it works as expected I guess, but I think it’s a better tradeoff to expect users to know that some devices require a bit more power, and have a plug that still works universally. “This charger doesn’t have enough power” is easy enough to be understood by a 90 yo I would think.

          Chargers should be labelled with the output they provide (mine are), but you are right, devices probably should be labelled better with what they require.

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            20 hours ago

            Admittedly, i’ve only had a couple cable problems and one of those would have likely been labeled wrong as they were cheap cables with max wattage programmed.

            One of my users came to me with a C-C phone cable that had used between a MacBook pro and a Mac charger. “This got really hot and started to stink when I used it”

            uhh, crap, here have this handed them a 6 foot 100w cable and please throw that old one away I’ll give you a new phone cable too.

            My other problem is with QC on random cables. I have some 6’ that won’t pass 25w. I have a Klein tester that will enumerate wattage. I throw away cables that won’t at least support fast charging.

            I also have a couple Samsung trio wireless multi-device chargers, they insonsistent. If I use the 45 watt Samsung brick that came with it it works fine. If I use any other brick, it refuses to use anything but a full on 65 watt charger. I don’t know if they ignore the spec, or enumerate differently, maybe they give a different output on 9v than others, but we need to have this overall issue with compatibility and semi-functional usage that just feels janky.

            I hope that eventually with GaN and other tech that everything will just do 100w or maybe all devices will go down to only needing 45 watt. It would be super nice if everything just played well together.

            • brbposting@sh.itjust.works
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              17 hours ago

              won’t pass 25w

              Reminded of what looked to be a great deal on USB-C cables from a major manufacturer (Anker I think).

              Fine print: not for MacBook Pro yaddayadda! Yeah the things can’t hang for it. Gotta spend way more.

              I wonder what the best cable labeling solution is for new cables purchased with known specs. Bet a handful of well-resourced geeks do their own printing right on them.

              • rumba@lemmy.zip
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                8 hours ago

                For a business, it’s buy analyzer and pick a minimum spec.

                For a home, pray the reviews are right.

          • tyler@programming.dev
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            19 hours ago

            Did you know that USB C cables can be unidirectional? As in, they only work plugged in in one direction. You know how I know that? Cause I’ve soldered usb-c cables myself. I own one that only plugs in in one direction (and works)! I’m honestly very surprised you’ve only had issues with charging, do you not need them for data? So many of my cables are charging only, they literally do not function for data at all. It’s a nightmare.

      • Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe
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        19 hours ago

        I’ve had exacrly 5x more failures of USB C ports than I’ve had of micro that is 5, and 1), and I’ve had way more micro devices over a much longer period (and still have some). It may technically be a “better” port, but my experience doesn’t reflect that.

        I have to label cables and chargers because some C devices today still don’t support all charging specs, so I have to verify a device charges on a charger to know for sure.

        At what point shouldn’t a device be able to negotiate down to the lowest charge capability, instead of not charge at all? That the spec permits this to happen is a major failure.

        It’s fantastic that C is the convergence standard, but let’s not act like it’s close to perfect. I have to verify with every device I use if the charger actually works for it, and not just “is the charger powerful enough”, but “does it actually charge even though I know it should because it supports all the capabilities as the device”.

        • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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          9 hours ago

          I don’t know why but my luck has been nearly opposite to yours. The only thing close I’ve had to your experience was I had a USBC port on my phone get dirty once and I had to clean it out. 0 actual hardware failures and very few charger problems

    • legion02@lemmy.world
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      23 hours ago

      Yeah, but at least you’re not sol when you’re at an apple house with an android device at 10% battery any more. If you need a cable with very specific capabilities that’s on you to do that research imo. The alternative is making every cable more expensive when most people don’t need it.

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        5 hours ago

        I’m looking forwards to when my in-laws upgrade their phones and no longer get to use their “superior” lightning ports

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        20 hours ago

        I saw that one back in the day. Never seen any of it in the wild yet.

        Would be nice to get TB/DP on there too.

        • tyler@programming.dev
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          19 hours ago

          And you’ll never see it on an Apple product, though you’ll never find an Apple product that isn’t supporting the full standard it’s still a problem when you’re trying to find a cable and aren’t sure if you’re using a real Apple one or a lookalike.

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            8 hours ago

            Apple sells 60 and 240 watt c-c cables.

            The 240 watt are only 5g

            The cables are unlabeled.

            They sell beats brand too, they are unlabeled to their speed.

    • Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      22 hours ago

      To solve the issue of identifying the capabilities of the cable: CaberQ.
      Though a bit expensive for what it is.

      • MisterD@lemmy.ca
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        17 hours ago

        https://caberqu.com/home/20-43-c2c-caberqu-746052578813.html#/27-with_or_without_case-with_case It’s not awful for price but there are more complete testers like treedix: https://treedix.com/

        What bothers me is all these testers assume you are a USB hardware wizard and know which pin combo supports which USB standard.

        I want something that tells you how fast and how much power the wire can handle.

        The newer cables have chips to talk to chargers to not exceed the power ratings. Why can’t these chips or testers also tell you how fast the wire can handle?

        • Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          12 hours ago

          What bothers me is all these testers assume you are a USB hardware wizard and know which pin combo supports which USB standard.

          The CaberQ can do exactly that.

        • JayGray91🐉🍕@piefed.social
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          15 hours ago

          I thought I was smart going back to a video that featured two USB C cable testers. I onky watched the video and didnt check or paid attention what the brand was.

          They are, in fact, these exact two brands.

      • rumba@lemmy.zip
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        22 hours ago

        Would have been nice for some kind of forethought on a labeling system.

        But there’s so many combinations now of power, data, audio, and video, and sup glasses of thunderbolt, display port, HDMI. Even if you put a 4-digit code on every cable listing exactly what they support people would never be able to understand and track down backward compatibility.

        I’d be surprised in the next port change if we don’t end up with some fiber optic in there.

      • rumba@lemmy.zip
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        21 hours ago

        Well, that covers my phone, but then 45 watts won’t run my laptop, and if I plug in my phone and my laptop, they only get 22 watts each.

        Then the cable: Can it be used for data transmission? What speeds does it cover? Will it transmit data through a DisplayPort or HDMI? If I unplug it from the power and plug it into the USB-C on my monitor, will I get video?

        There are so many features, and it’s not like you can just go ohh I’ll get this USB-4_g cable and know what it does. Even the webpage for the Rundhult has no mention of what features are supported other than 100w.

        The whole spec is complicated AF. You could spend $100 on a brick/cable that can do either 100W or high speed, but if you only need part of the equation, you can spend $30 on a brick and cable. What they support is almost never enumerated, even on the packaging.

        • couldhavebeenyou@lemmy.zip
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          19 hours ago

          Your laptop will charge at 22 or 45W. Easy!

          Cable will work for data at usb 2.0, as it says on the packaging. So it won´t work for video alt modes. Easy!

          My monitor has an input cable that allows for maximum video resolution and maximum power delivery. I never need to take it out. Easy!

          • rumba@lemmy.zip
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            8 hours ago

            So what happens when your laptop is pulling more than 22w?

            Let’s say your cable is 5G. Guess what, that doesn’t mean it supports display port or thunderbolt.

            These cables all have ID chips in them that tell the systems what they do and don’t support. 1 they just can’t be bothered to put it on the packaging, 2 a lot of the cheapest Chinese cables have their chips set incorrectly.

            The one cable for all solutions problem is a great idea. They could just standardize on a 240 watt 40/60 cable and sell it everywhere that would be great. Hell, I’d be satisfied if there were two cables, 240/5 with black connectors and a 65/60 with white connectors.

            • couldhavebeenyou@lemmy.zip
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              8 hours ago

              Then you need a more powerful charger!

              If you really keep tumbling into these kind of situations, you need to a) read up on what you buy or b) get advice from a trusted seller. Easy!

            • couldhavebeenyou@lemmy.zip
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              18 hours ago

              The one that came with my monitor. Easy!

              If I ever need a new one for such an extremely specific task, I´ll make sure to spend a few minutes to make sure I buy the right one. Takes a minute, but easy!

              The Ikea one says it only supports 480Mbps, so that´s a no-no for video. Sad, but easy!

              • tyler@programming.dev
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                13 hours ago

                lol, no it’s not easy. You saying “easy” doesn’t mean it is in any sense of the word. Like the person you’ve been responding to before said, usb c can support many things and not support others. For example, USB C cables can literally be unidirectional! That sure isn’t listed because it’s assumed to work bidirectionally, but it’s not a requirement. I literally have a unidirectional usb c cable in fact.

                Just cause it says 480 doesn’t mean jack when

                1. You weren’t talking about this cable originally, you were making a claim about a cable that literally wasn’t mentioned in the article. I gave an example of a cable that directly disproved your comment in a facetious manner.

                2. No consumer should be expected to know usb c standards (that’s literally the point of this conversation)

                3. 480 Mbps has nothing to do with supporting video. This Reddit thread explains it way better than I can, but support for a feature in the cable has absolutely nothing to do with data transfer rate. https://www.reddit.com/r/UsbCHardware/comments/ji87mc/usb_32_gen_2_typec_monitor_compatibility/j5dohy5/

                • couldhavebeenyou@lemmy.zip
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                  12 hours ago
                  1. I was the one that mentioned the 100W Ikea cable as a cheap example to combine with that charger

                  2. Too bad if someone doesn´t want to know the tiniest bit about standards. They´ll have to get help if they don´t want to read the packaging or symbology. Meanwhile the rest of us can enjoy hooking up our phones to our laptop chargers or monitors without having to waste resources on unnecessarily complex cables

                  3. If you want to do something fancy like hooking up to your monitor, you´ll have to use the unusually sturdy cable that came with it or take 2 minutes to read about which cable you need

        • rmuk@feddit.uk
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          22 hours ago

          Once you’ve used one you’ll be angry that they’re not standard, at least on desktop/kiosk devices. USB-A also had that as an option.

          • Onomatopoeia@lemmy.cafe
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            18 hours ago

            I use Goop adhesive for cables I don’t want falling out.

            Only takes a tiny amount at the connector shoulder, it’ll never fall out but is still removable by hand.

            Or if I really want it to stay, I use a lot of goop, and I know that fucker is never coming out without a sharp knife.

      • latenightnoir@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        15 hours ago

        In all seriousness, this would make the most sense in terms of progression in design. It already sorta’ is just that, but it’s been stepped on.

        Hah! Just hit me, if I’d seen a USB-C plug back in the day, my first thought would’ve been “oof, someone isn’t playing bootleg cartridge games for a while!”

    • BeatTakeshi@lemmy.world
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      21 hours ago

      My guess is USB D will be one dimensional, ie a cylinder pin, like the good old headphone jack. You can plug it with your eyes closed or in the dark

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    24 hours ago

    I spent 40 years in the computer industry. I learned one thing very early on.

    The only standard in the computer industry is that there isn’t one.

    • kibiz0r@midwest.social
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      20 hours ago

      Beginner in IT:

      “The problem is that there isn’t one”

      Expert:

      “The problem is that there isn’t one

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      23 hours ago

      No way, it’s a MASSIVE pile of standards. The entire internet and networking in general only functions because of standards. HTML5’s main benefit was standardizing a ton of BS everyone was playing around with.

      What isn’t standard are the few higher level frameworks and BS people are playing around with, but saying that’s all of the computer industry is like that old meme of Homer getting pulled most of the way up the mountain by sherpas in a sleeping bag…

        • MotoAsh@lemmy.world
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          22 hours ago

          Yes I know the joke. My point is that it is only true for the developing front of engineering. Everyone is still, in fact, standing on a mountain of well established and followed standards while debating the future.

      • GreenCrunch@lemmy.today
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        23 hours ago

        Even USB-C is a nightmare. There’s 3.0, 3.1, and 3.2, which were rebranded as “3.2 Gen X” with some stupid stuff there as far as what speed it supports.

        Then it can do DisplayPort as well. There used to be an HDMI alt mode too!

        An Intel computer might have Thunderbolt over the same cable, and can send PCIe signals over the cable to plug in a graphics card or other devices.

        Then there’s USB 4 which works like Thunderbolt but isn’t restricted to Intel devices.

        Then there’s the extended power profile which lets you push 240 W through a USB C port.

        For a while, the USB-C connector was on graphics cards as Virtualink, which was supposed to be a one-cable standardized solution to plugging in VR headsets. Except that no headsets used it.

        Then there’s Nintendo. The Switch has a Type-C port, but does its own stupid thing for video, so it can’t work with a normal dock because it’s a freak.

        So you pick up a random USB C cable and have no information on what it may be capable of, plug it into a port where you again don’t know the capabilities. Its speed may be anywhere between 1.5 MBit/s (USB 1.0 low speed) and 80 GBit/s (USB 4 2.0) and it may provide between 5 and 240 W of power.

        Every charger has a different power output, and sometimes it leads to a stupid situation like the Dell 130 W laptop charger. In theory, 130 W is way more than what most phones will charge at. But it only offers that at I think 20 V, which my phone can’t take. So in practice, your phone will charge at the base 5W over it.

        Dell also has a laptop dock for one of their laptops that uses TWO Type-C ports, for more gooderness or something, I don’t know. Meaning it will only fit that laptop with ports exactly that far apart.

        The USB chaos does lead to fun discoveries, such as when I plugged a Chromecast with Google TV’s power port into a laptop dock and discovered that it actually supports USB inputs, which is cool.

        And Logitech still can’t make a USB-C dongle for their mouse.

        At least it’s not a bunch of proprietary barrel chargers. My parents have a whole box of orphaned chargers with oddly specific voltages from random devices.

        • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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          4 hours ago

          But it only offers that at I think 20 V, which my phone can’t take

          This is actually a big part of many of the high speed charging standards that phones use, is it will actually charge at a higher voltage to lower the amperage. I don’t know off the top of my head if USB-PD does this on phones but I know the old Qualcomm Quick Charge standard did it a lot. I think it went as high as 24V if I remember correctly

          Then of course for a while lots of phones supported competing standards of quick charging and nobody allowed anyone else to use the same branding so identifying compatible chargers for your phone’s specific type of quick charge was a royal pain in the butt

        • MotoAsh@lemmy.world
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          22 hours ago

          Yes, and USB-C is barely a decade old. A single standard, about a universal by name port. Computer science, y’know the thing it’s all meant to benefit, is over a century old. There is a MOUNTAIN of standards we’re all standing on, whether or not you care to admit it.

      • BeBopALouie@lemmy.ca
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        23 hours ago

        Umm, that is my point. Due to the massive pile of “standards” there really is not one standard in any part of the industry as it will change within months etc.

        • MotoAsh@lemmy.world
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          22 hours ago

          No, you misunderstand the scope of standards I’m referencing. Computer science goes back over a century, yet you’re attempting to tell me there are no established standards based on something that’s barely even a decade old as a consumer product standard.